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Poster: Show Companion Date: Sep 3, 2007 8:16am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

It's not a question. I just want to see if there is anybody out there with the balls to seriously refute that statement.

This post was modified by Show Companion on 2007-09-03 15:16:58

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Poster: AshesRising Date: Sep 4, 2007 2:48pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

Show Companion: this was a great post -- Thank You. You made this dogs past 36-hours very, very enjoyable -- put sunshine into an already sunny day. I look forward to whatever else you have in mind.

Thanks again; as always, send me an email if you think I may have some tunes you want [all commercial release stuff; other people are better at the other formats] --- AshesRising

[Jerri1031-dp3 AT yahoo DOT com]

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Poster: William Tell Date: Sep 3, 2007 8:10am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Not the powers that be...

I would pick Beauty, Workingman's, and the first for Studio. Live, for live. Can't pick one over the other--too different. But I take your point.

Hmmm, Ashes may be on to something...check out the rankings below. Can you guess before looking? Top "Pop" ranking? "Quickest" to "Gold?"

Interesting...

"Date of Official Release Title Notes / RIAA certification Billboard magazine peak position

March 17, 1967 The Grateful Dead
Gold: November 11, 1971
Pop Albums: #37

July 18, 1968 Anthem of the Sun
Pop Albums: #87

June 20, 1969 Aoxomoxoa
Gold: March 13, 1997
Pop Albums: #73

November 10, 1969 Live/Dead Live
Recorded January-March 1969 at various locations
Gold: August 24, 2001
Pop Albums: #64

June 14, 1970 Workingman's Dead
Gold: July 7, 1974
Platinum: October 13, 1986
Pop Albums: #27

November 1970 American Beauty
Gold: July 7, 1974
Platinum: October 13, 1986
Double Platinum: August 24, 2001
Pop Albums: #30

October 1971 Grateful Dead
(also known as Skull & Roses) Live
Recorded early 1971 at various locations
Pop Albums: #25

November 5, 1972 Europe '72 Live
Recorded April-May 1972 at various European locations
Gold: December 14, 1972
Platinum: August 24, 2001
Double Platinum: August 24, 2001
Pop Albums: #20

July 13, 1973 History of the Grateful Dead
Volume One (Bear's Choice) Live
February 13 & 14, 1970
Fillmore East in New York City
Pop Albums: #60

October 15, 1973 Wake of the Flood
Pop Albums: #18

June 27, 1974 Grateful Dead from the Mars Hotel
Pop Albums: #17

August, 1975 Blues for Allah
Pop Albums: #12

June 1976 Steal Your Face Live
Recorded October 16-20, 1974 at Winterland Arena,
San Francisco
Pop Albums: #56

July 27, 1977 Terrapin Station
Gold: September 4, 1987
Pop Albums: #28

November 15, 1978 Shakedown Street
Gold: September 4, 1987
Pop Albums: #41

April 28, 1980 Go to Heaven
Pop Albums: #23

April 1, 1981 Reckoning Live
Recorded September 25 - October 31, 1980
at the Warfield Theater, San Francisco and
Radio City Music Hall, New York
Pop Albums: #43

August 1981 Dead Set Live
Recorded at same shows as Reckoning
Pop Albums: #29

July 6, 1987 In the Dark
Gold: September 4, 1987
Platinum: September 18 1987
Double Platinum: September 10, 1995
Billboard 200: #6

January 30, 1989 Dylan & The Dead Live
Recorded July 1987
Gold Billboard 200: #37

October 31, 1989 Built to Last
Gold: January 3, 1990 Billboard 200: #27

September 1990 Without a Net Live
Recorded October, 1989 - April, 1990 at various locations
Gold: November 27, 1990
Billboard 200: #29"






This post was modified by William Tell on 2007-09-03 15:10:24

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Poster: acetboy Date: Sep 3, 2007 12:21pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.

.

This post was modified by acetboy on 2008-05-29 23:30:05

This post was modified by Diana Hamilton on 2007-09-03 19:21:40

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Poster: William Tell Date: Sep 3, 2007 8:30am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.

You know I am an early era fanatic, BUT I always had the same feeling you did about the album layout, so to speak (Live). The beauty of the whole fall and spring buildup of the two suites (DS-->SS-->11-->DDHNM; CE-->OO-->CE-->NPC-->FB) didn't really have justice done to them til the big ten disk set was released a short while back. There the beauty of it comes shining thru, and somehow that was missing from the original release...part of it being the 'problem' with album format limitations, but something else, intangible, I think. Not sure what, but there you have it...sorry I can't be more specific.

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Poster: Street Pig ! Date: Sep 3, 2007 6:15am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.

Although LIVE DEAD gave alot of heads who hadn't seen them yet their first experience on what a Dead show was like (priror to massive trading)It is rather difficult to coin the phrase BEST album to it. American Beauty and Workingmans were classics for sure. Aoxomoxoa had superb tunes on it,Blues for Allah was a groundbreaker too. The best album is in the ears of the listener.......

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Poster: BryanE Date: Sep 3, 2007 9:05am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

Takes a lotta balls to throw down the gauntlet like that.

While Live Dead certainly has a special place in my heart, and many critics would agree with that "best" designation, I'm following the lead of the Europe '72 people.

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Poster: patourkid Date: Sep 3, 2007 9:28am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

That's like saying apples are the best fruit. I'm an orange man myself... or peaches ....or BANANAS.. MMMMMMM....bananas yep it's gotta be bananas, or oh wait I forgot about pineapple...oh they're all so good!!!!!

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Poster: AshesRising Date: Sep 3, 2007 11:50am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

durians ...absolutely the best ...durians are to fruit the way "Built To Last" is to Live/Dead [and every other "Grateful Dead" released that I mentioned in a different post]

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Poster: I_love_you Date: Sep 3, 2007 3:20pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

I CANNOT BELIVE THAT NOBODY MENTIONS THE ANTHEM!!! !!!! like i've been a deadhead since '94 (hygate VT first and only show) when i was three and have been listening to them and other musical giants since( can you tell?-i am 2nd generation) ...but anyway im not some young upstart in the traditional sence, but o my god have you guys like taken acid? comon at least the first three songs on anthem(or six?) are an orchestral phenomenon that rival Mozart and the great Ludwig Van (me brothers) well there i said it, what do you all think?

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Poster: robthewordsmith Date: Sep 3, 2007 4:24pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

Calm down, buddy. No reason to get excited, as the the thief advised. Whisper it, but if I could take just one Anthem of the Sun would be what I reached for.

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Poster: AshesRising Date: Sep 3, 2007 4:40pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

Hey: actually, I didn't mention it because I think this was the one that Garcia absolutely hated for many, many reasons. There are others here much more knowledgeable than me that can confirm which one of the early albums Jerry hated. (remember: minus the bonus tracks, etc., etc. -- just the original LP) This is the album that the producer literally walked out on them in the middle of "Born Cross-Eyed" when Bobby excitedly found the perfect spot for "the sound of thick air."

--- AshesRising

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Poster: cream-puff-war Date: Sep 3, 2007 10:42pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

The one that Garcia hated... in the early '70s, I read something somewhere where he said the live tapes used for the album were about what they were doing that night, and they were playing a lot better since the recordings...
but that when he heard the recordings a while later he thought those performances had a lot of energy...

I don't recall if he was talking about Anthem or Live Dead, or maybe even the Vintage Dead (1966-09-16) lp.

When I first listened to Europe '72 (in '73) I thought it was unfocused, had no spine-tingling riffs (like Live Dead)... I tried to get into it but found a whole side of The Other One over long and rambling with nothing to grab onto...

2 non-Dead Head friends of mine (now) have said Europe '72 is their favorite Dead lp...

Now how 'bout a thread picking their best single... as in, 45 7"??


Attachment: 45UncleJohnHollandsleeve.gif
Attachment: 45AlabamaUSFront.gif
Attachment: 45ChinaCatJapanFront.gif

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Poster: AshesRising Date: Sep 3, 2007 11:25pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

cream-puff-war: Good Evening -- it's always great to see your name re-appear here. I still have not been able to find the source where Jerry states that he really disliked one of those early albums. By a process of elimination and other info regarding "Anthem," my best guess is that "Anthem" is the one he disliked. (Though it is just a guess and the album is great, esp compared to most of the stuff in the 1980's after "Reckoning.")

All notes are from: http://www.deaddisc.com/GDFD_Grateful_Dead.htm

In regards to their first album, "The Grateful Dead," Jerry said, "I think our album is honest. It sounds just like us. It even has mistakes on it. But it also has a certain amount of excitement on it. It sounds like we felt good when we were making it. We made it in a short period, four days, and it's the material we've been doing onstage for quite a long time. It sounds like one of our good sets."

In regards to Aoxomoxoa, Jerry stated in a "Rolling Stone" interview, "...one of my pet records, 'cause it was the first stuff that I thought was starting to sound like how I wanted to hear songs sound." He also had some non-flattering comments about the album, however he clearly states that it was the genesis of crafting lyrics with Hunter so overall it appears he was satisfied with Aoxomoxoa.

Live/Dead: one of their best albums. Jerry would appreciate "Show Companion's" post.

That leaves "Anthem of the Sun:"
Though I don't have a quote from Jerry at the moment, here are some notes that shed some light on why he may have disliked it (if, in fact, the premise is true):

After recording their first album quickly the second took many months to put together, firstly with largely unsuccessful studio sessions then with lengthy assemblage of material from live shows.

Producer Hassinger bailed out part way through the process supposedly after Weir requested "the sound of thick air" during Born Cross-Eyed.

It's thought that the majority of the live music used on this album is from the February 14, 1968 show at the Carousel though this is much overdubbed with parts from other shows.

So, that's it for now. Again, great to see your name heree; it's wonderful to read your posts.

I hope all is well, --- AshesRising

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Poster: cream-puff-war Date: Sep 4, 2007 12:27am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

hey AshesRising, doin' ok my friend!

I think you're right; Anthem of the Sun is most likely what Jerry was talking about in the thing I read, (which may have been in Rolling Stone).

From the Billboard chart numbers, it seems that Workingman's Dead is the one that put them on the map after several slow sellers since their debut...

it was really a favorite locally at the time, and American Beauty was just icing on the cake, though it did have the minor hit, Truckin'...

but listen to the tapes, and notice how the crowds of '69 and '70 always cheered when they started up St. Stephen...

Everyone agrees (?) that was their most popular in-concert tune during those 2 years...




Attachment: anthem-to-booty.jpg
Attachment: workingmans-dead-single-cover.jpg

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Poster: BryanE Date: Sep 3, 2007 4:57pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

Wasn't that also the one that used tapes of the show when Jerry pushed Phil down the stairs afterward, growling "PLAY, MOTHERFUCKER!" at him?

"When we listened to the tapes later, they were just crackling with energy . . . we ended up using them on our album . . . I just need to learn to keep my mouth shut."

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Poster: glenn Date: Sep 4, 2007 12:03am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

"the sound of thick air."

I never heard this tale... where do I find the details?

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Poster: cream-puff-war Date: Sep 4, 2007 12:14am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

from the horse's mouth in: Anthem to Beauty (dvd/vhs)

May well be the finest documentary on the band, spotlighting the making of Anthem of the Sun and American Beauty.

available for as low a buck and 3 bits from amazon, and it's been shown on PBS...

This post was modified by cream-puff-war on 2007-09-04 07:14:05

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Poster: AshesRising Date: Sep 4, 2007 12:19am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

doctor:
Hit this link and scroll down to "Notes." They insert the word "supposedly," however I'll bet my ash that it is true:

http://www.deaddisc.com/disc/Anthem_Of_The_Sun.htm

Hope all is well for you; dropped my external hard-drive as I moved into a new hotel last night so that is why you haven't heard from me regarding other items. Gotta get the info off it somehow later today. --- AshesRising

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Poster: glenn Date: Sep 4, 2007 1:14am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

Ashes Rising... I was wondering why I hadn't heard from you regarding the video editing or whatever you needed... you still have my email I assume?

Thanks for the quick response, both of you, I'll get my hands on Anthem to Beauty this week and check it out.

The only Grateful Dead album I ever bought was Mars Hotel, pretty much too broke to buy albums, rather spent my money on concert tickets. (Mars Hotel from a bargain shop brand-new, around 2 bucks I think... on real vinyl) I don't have any of my albums from my tiny collection anymore, but I still have my memories of the shows I was able to make it to, and I don't regret spending the money on memories instead of tangibles.

But I have to say the album version of Terrapin Station, (Europe 72?) with the orchestra is quite nice.



This post was modified by glenn on 2007-09-04 08:14:08

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Poster: BryanE Date: Sep 3, 2007 4:07pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

I_love_you, I love Anthem.

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Poster: AshesRising Date: Sep 4, 2007 11:14am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

I_love_you: (Nice name - how did you come up with that one?)

I have been thinking a lot about your post from yesterday so I went to listen to "Anthem" again ...only to find that I cannot find it with the rest of my material here at the hotel "on the road." (no pun intended)

To answer your inquiries:
1.) no on the acid. The only true acid, in my opinion, was Dr. Hoffmann's and most of Owsley's; anything else is a variation on the theme and, like a really bad "cover band" tryin' to play "Saint Stephen," there were too many variations with a lot of them being just total crap, absolute crap. I prefer fungi.

My motto: "if it grows, let it flow"

2.) No, I didn't know you were a "2nd generation." (I have never even heard that term before. However, you are the person who posted that your Mom saw the boys in Boulder 1980, right? My first "road trip" ...ending in Alaska. ....well, she obviously turned you on to great music.) I like the fact that you avoided the usual label attached to the post-1987 band's fans. I tend to think of the followers of the band from any generation, whether they attended shows or not, as "the Chosen Ones." It can keep one humble; unfortunately I tend to forget the humility part a lot --- regardless, I still like the term.

4.) Mozart ...certainly a talented cat but Bach is the one for me so I cannot comment. I tend to think of three of the GD's members as: Mozart = Weir; Wagner = Lesh; Bach/Beethoven combo = Jerry.

Hey, "I_love_you," as I was looking for the unfound "Anthem" last night and today I found something that I would like to send to you. I know you will like it if you don't have it already. I am pruning my collection and I give away all my "duplicate" cd's or "partial duplicate" cd's (all commercially released) to people when "I (hear) a Voice telling me to" "miracle" a particular soul. If interested, send email to:
Jerri1031-dp3 AT yahoo DOT com (keep sending emails if I don't respond -- I respond to everything with my "real" email address.)

Nice post; now I gotta go find Anthem --- AshesRising

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Poster: huntr Date: Sep 4, 2007 9:05am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

to me Anthem is the best..

its all subjective tho ..

and Im not articulate enough to mount a defense...

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Poster: cream-puff-war Date: Sep 4, 2007 11:36am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

Anthem is their Sgt. Pepper's, as one grease monkey once said to me way back when.

Ironically - given the split decision of this thread more or less, mainly between Live Dead and Anthem, with several close-up contenders to be sure -

Anthem and Live Dead were my first and only Grateful Dead albums during the sunny spring, summer and fall of 1970 as I began enjoying evenings with the Grateful Dead and friends at the Carousel Ballroom.


I can't think of too many other Dead albums that are just one long non-stop groove.

Maybe Europe '72, except I couldn't find the groove to kick back with, too bad I couldn't just settle into it.

Workingman's and Beauty were record records... a series of individual tracks; tho Workingman's was nearly perfect as such things go - hearing that really made us want to see the band in a live setting to hear them do the material even better.

With Live Dead and Anthem, one hoped they would play those numbers as good as they did on the records -
Both lps represent their playing at it's best.

Often as not, their other ones, even the live albums such as Steal Your Face and Europe '72 are not their best playing of the tours they represent.

The best of the studio lps, classics such as Mars Hotel, Blues For Allah, Aoxomoxoa, Terrapin Station, Wake of the Flood and Beauty -
I feel they eventually became dated in light of how much better they would improve upon the initial laying down of the tracks,
though it was lots of fun to play them back when relatively few decent live tapes and vintage shows on MGM subsidiary labels or lo-fi bootlegs were being circulated.

I got all the way to Mexico with an 8-track of Mars Hotel jerking it's way from mid-song to mid-song,
and no one in the death car (the recalled Corvair) complained, I don't know - maybe it was the Begonias!

Thus, their best single just may well be a criss-crossing of the two high watermark lps - Live/Anthem:

Dark Star/Born Cross-Eyed

(with Golden Road/Cream Puff War a very close 2nd imho)


This post was modified by cream-puff-war on 2007-09-04 18:36:44

Attachment: 45DarkStarUSSleeve.gif

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Poster: AshesRising Date: Sep 3, 2007 7:50am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.

"Show Companion:" You're just foolin' around right? GRATE sarcastic post, buddie; I haven't been able to respond 'cuz I've been laughin' so guckin' hard: "Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album." Guckin hilarious!!! Simply GRATE!!! I cannot figure out the technique of employing the word "the" twice and, utilizing one of them, I assume, to replace the word "is." [I type the word "assume" 'cuz anybody who can write such a funny post has a method to her/his/its madness.]

I think you are really asking people for their opinion as to what album released by the "Grateful Dead" is the best. (I never bought or heard any of the "Dead's" album --- or, "The Other Ones," "Rat-Dog," etc. so I have to limit myself to the "Grateful Dead.")

The best "Grateful Dead" album is without a doubt, "Built To Last."
1.)Foolish Heart (Garcia/Hunter)
2.)Just A Little Light (Mydland/Barlow)
3.) Victim Or The Crime (Weir/Graham)
4.) Standing On The Moon (Garcia/Hunter)
5.) Blow Away (Mydland/Barlow)
6.) Picasso Moon (Weir/Barlow/Bralove)
7.) Built To Last (Garcia/Hunter)
8.)I Will Take You Home (Mydland/Barlow)

>We Can Run (Mydland/Barlow) (Included only on CD and cassette releases)

Bonus tracks on CD version released in the "Beyond Description" box set in 2004 and as a separate CD in 2006:

Foolish Heart (Garcia/Hunter) - Live, 7/19/89
Blow Away (Mydland/Barlow) - Live, 7/7/89
California Earthquake (Whole Lotta Shakin' Goin' On) (Crowell) - Live, 10/20/89

Let me know if you need a copy, esp of the one with the bonus tracks. GRATE POST!!! I hope you have a GRATE Labor day.

This post was modified by AshesRising on 2007-09-03 14:44:58

This post was modified by AshesRising on 2007-09-03 14:50:19

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Poster: grendelschoice Date: Sep 3, 2007 7:53am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.

I like Europe '72 a lot better than LiveDead, so yeah, I seriously refute your post.

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Poster: ganges Date: Sep 3, 2007 8:04am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.

I'm with Grendelschoice here (tough decision thinking of American Beauty,Skull and Roses + Wake Of The Flood)

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Poster: grendelschoice Date: Sep 3, 2007 8:12am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.

Hey, Ashes...

Things are good...Happy Labor Day to you, and to all (I'm working today, sadly, but will get a future day off for it).

Europe '72 features those great tunes you mentoned, plus let us not forget one of the (if the the finest) China>Riders ever...debuts of Ramble on Rose and He's Gone on record, and so much more.

Ganges--nice call on Wake of the Flood...the contents of that album read like a dream set list....Eyes, Stella, Row Jimmy, LIG, etc.

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Poster: AshesRising Date: Sep 3, 2007 9:18am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.

...well, I hope you are gettin' through the day OK ..yeah, I was just mentioning two of my "unsung hero's" from that album. ...many, many nights at school melted from the "Truckin' into Morning Dew" disc ...and then out to watch the sunrise. [Am listening to the entire "Vault Box Set" monster that was given to me as a "Thank You" gift for burnin' discs. ...and then back to Englishtown '77 again!)Can you send me your email? I destroyed an external drive last night as I moving into another hotel..........

--- AshesRising

(Jerri1031-dp3 AT yahoo DOT com }

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Poster: grendelschoice Date: Sep 4, 2007 2:17am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.





This post was modified by grendelschoice on 2007-09-04 09:17:36

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Poster: AshesRising Date: Sep 3, 2007 4:21pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.

got it; now delete it

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Poster: Big LMA Lock Date: Sep 3, 2007 4:32pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.

.........? ass issues I presume ?

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Poster: AshesRising Date: Sep 3, 2007 7:58am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead the the best Dead album.

grendelschoice: not a surprise at all that you "have the balls" to refute this cat's assertion. "You Win Again" and "It Hurts Me Too" are two jewels from that album. Hope all is well.

--- AshesRising

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Poster: jglynn1.2 Date: Sep 6, 2007 7:47am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Everyone agrees that LiveDead is the best Dead album.

I always liked the first album best - I love "Golden Road To Unlimited Devotion"